A bad workman always blames his tools.

I saw fully kitted out experienced guys (looking like Arnie in Commando, with pouches, extra scopes, spare mags, etc.) get beat by a noob girl* with an MP5 on one mission. She hit each of the twelve targets with just one bb each.


*No offence meant to the actual person, just that it was her first time at airsoft (she had done laser tag and paintball before) and she was a young woman. Well, young compared to me anyway.

_________________
Steve
Corporal in 69th Regt. 1st Batt. Homer’s Heroes.

"I'd like to die at the age of 80 in my own bed, with a belly full of wine and a girl's mouth around my c**k."

Intersting discussion this, and to quote a well known phrase, I'm not trying to 'rain on anyones parade' here nor derail this thread. But to say that someone, as a 'crown servant' is exempt from the vcra is quite a statement to make, especially as someone in the U.K here ( the original poster) is exploring options to acquire a thompson for his PR build.

As per the HM Revenue and Customs website:

Generally speaking Crown servants are employees whose-

* Offices or employments are carried out under the Crown,
* Duties of employment are of a public nature, and
* Salaries are paid out of the public funds of the UK or Northern Ireland.

Examples of offices or employments under the Crown are:

* HM Forces
* Civil Servants
* Diplomats

http://charterconsultation.hmrc.gov.uk/cnr/faq1.htm

As can be seen, crown servant extends beyond those serving in whatever capacity they do in the armed forces. An admin assistant working for the ministry of agriculture is as much a 'crown servant' as someone in the regular army. They are both servants of the Queen but obviously have vastly different jobs. An inference that can be drawn from your statement is that all 'crown servants are exempt' , which is suggesting that ANY person employed under the crown can buy R.i.F's . This assumption is incorrect, however within the spirit of your statement I'm assuming that your comment was made from your own perspective, i.e. as an Army Reservist who obviously is a crown servant.

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/Acts/acts2006/ukpga_20060038_en_5#pt2-pb5

37 Specific defences applying to the offence under s. 36

(f) the purposes of functions that a person has in his capacity as a person in the service of Her Majesty.

What subsection (f) within section 37 of the act implies is what PVB has suggested. The exemption extends to those employed by the crown who would need to procure imatation firearms within the scope of the job they are doing within their given government organisation which explains the 'in the service of Her Majesty' part . In essence, they are exempt from this section of the act to purchase for their government department in whatever capacity that maybe. An example of this would be a police force buying R.i.F's for training and recognition purposes. I have seen replice guns used in this way within two different government departments I have previously worked in. R.i.F's have been used in the past by the Army.

There is a difference between buying R.i.F's on behalf of a crown department, for use by that department, and someone buying R.i.F's as a crown servant for their own personal use. As far as the latter goes, and it appears that this is your situation, then the exemption does not extend to cover you and so you would still need to go through the normal channels of joining an airsoft club etc.

I really hate when threads get suddenly turned into a what's legal in the UK for airsoft or some imitations. Then come the legislation quotes, boring discussion in what someone believes their government should do then how to get around it by "registering" that fake BB gun, do a "skirmish" so many times a month then you can own it. Christ, airsoft isn't even a REAL firearm, which has more meaning & placement in the Ready Line than ANY friggin' BB gun.

Mods, can't this regional airsoft crap be sent to the airsoft area....where it belongs and keep film & USCM/Xeno costume related posts here where they belong......on the Ready Line? Another place is to the regional noticeboard this thread would pertain to.



My very harsh constructive criticism from a right wing, gun toting, beer swizzling, woman loving redneck from Alberta, Canada.

Airborne Mike

HURAHHHH!!!!!!!

_________________
There is nothing more impressive than a bloody big Alien wiggling on the end of a sharp stick!

Why do we hide our right wingers in western Canada..?

Lova ya Mike.

He might be "direct"- but Mike has a point.

Threads about UK laws concerning RIFs should really be in the UKCM forum as it is only the UKCM that is affected by it- including the sticky that has been on page one of the Ready Line for what... over two years now?

Don't get me wrong- I'm not about segregating the board as we are ALL allowed to view and post in each and every forum, but feel there should be a little more firmness (for lack of a better word) about what topics go where.


EDIT- this is what I get for not taking a better look at the stickies... looks like the UK RIF one has been moved (or at least unstuck). Probably for a while now eh?

My apologies. Carry on.

Kevin

_________________
I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me! WHY DIDN'T YOU BELIEVE ME!?!

SSgt Burton beat me to it so my post irrelevant

_________________
Reformed Pacifist

Problem solved - "UK" added to thread title.

The UKARA discussion is not purely relative to Airsofters, as the Violent Crime Reduction Act applies to any item that resembles a firearm.
Airsoft or not. Solid resin, painted capgun, moulded from fecking liquorice... If it's the same size, shape and colour as a real weapon, the Act applies.

Therefore any discussion that touches upon the purchase of any such item within the UK should have mention of the law if there's a chance that someone could end up falling foul of legislation through ignorance.

_________________
MSgt, UKCM 42nd Reg., 1st Batt. : Hadrian's Wall. UKCM

Wasteland Workshop
Props, cosplay pieces, upcycled ornamentation, and miscellanea;
For the discerning survivor of the apocalypse.
Steve Fletcher : Maker, Scavenger, and Junksmith.
linktr.ee/wastelandworkshop

Everyone just move here to the US and buy whatever gun you want

Real, resin, plastic, ones made of PVC and gas cans, etc...(Ohhhhh..it's not "too soon" for PIG jokes anymore )


Derek

_________________
Cpl D. Smith CMD
A04/TQ1.0.62147E1


RIP Pvt. Chris Chulamanis A14/TQ4.0.66993E7 You are missed.

I'm not a mod, I'm just a grunt. Problem is NOT solved.

Just because you think this regional info is important doesn't give you the right to post it in the Ready Line to gain more exposure. Maybe this UK info can be moved to the UK section. I wonder how cranky US/UK/rest of the world would feel if I start posting Canadian gun laws in the Ready Line ...... like mag capacities, firearm types, Possession Acquisition Licensees, shotgun barrel lengths, quoting laws, rules, regulations, permits, storage, carry legislation and somehow tie it into VP70, M41A1, Ithaca Model 37 then put (CDN) at the end of the title. Yeah, how ON TOPIC on the Ready Line for all international AL members would that be? Remember, the AL is International NOT a Regional board. You want to post UK regional topics, then go to that section, go to your own forum http://www.StuffImportantToMe.uk or make your own forum and give 'er.

Mike

_________________
There is nothing more impressive than a bloody big Alien wiggling on the end of a sharp stick!

The guy's question was valid worldwide - "What's his best bet for a resin Thompson?"
The fact that he's in the UK meant that the answer was slightly different than if he'd been elsewhere.

I guess we could move every single Pulse Rifle/Smartgun/VP70/etc topic to the poster's own country's forum, but I think that's overkill.

If someone from the US posted on the Ready Like for advice on gear, I would have zero problem with people quoting US law for his benefit.
Same goes for Canadians, Australians and Arcturians.

S'pose we could put it to a vote - "Any gun-related topics must be in one of the national boards, and not on the Ready Line". Yay or Nay?

_________________
MSgt, UKCM 42nd Reg., 1st Batt. : Hadrian's Wall. UKCM

Wasteland Workshop
Props, cosplay pieces, upcycled ornamentation, and miscellanea;
For the discerning survivor of the apocalypse.
Steve Fletcher : Maker, Scavenger, and Junksmith.
linktr.ee/wastelandworkshop

I think that all posts relating to the first two films should be in the UK section since they were filmed here.

Okay sarcasm and unnecessary exaggeration aside-

The fact is that the important part of the thread was the fact that the thread starter was based in the UK and has to deal with the UK's RIF laws.

No one other than citizens of the UK would be able to answer that question best. Would it make sense for an American or Canadian to try and answer a question about UK importation laws?

This is why the question should be posed in the UK forum.

But I do understand the "UK" in the title means that anyone who doesn't care doesn't have to read it. And as far as forum "strictness" goes, I know we are pretty loose compared to other boards.

Oh and by the way- James Cameron is Canadian so the whole board should be in the UACM section.

And one more thing- I know and I'm pretty sure Mike knows that nothing is going to change around here.

Kevin

_________________
I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me! WHY DIDN'T YOU BELIEVE ME!?!

If something needed changed, we would change it, dude.

But I honestly think that this sort of chat is relevant for the Ready Line forum, as although some aspects ( Legal ) of the discussion may be UK specific, others ( Recommendations ) apply worldwide.

The thread starter wasn't asking about UK importation laws - If he had been, then I agree that the thread may have been better placed elsewhere.
He was asking what resin kits were available - Not realising that resin kits also come under the legislation.
And, as it turns out, we cleared up his and Assimilate's misunderstanding of the law and potentially saved them trouble/opened their options up a little.

If the topic had been strictly UK-based, then some input from the rest of the world about what he might want to buy may have been missed.

_________________
MSgt, UKCM 42nd Reg., 1st Batt. : Hadrian's Wall. UKCM

Wasteland Workshop
Props, cosplay pieces, upcycled ornamentation, and miscellanea;
For the discerning survivor of the apocalypse.
Steve Fletcher : Maker, Scavenger, and Junksmith.
linktr.ee/wastelandworkshop

Point taken.

Pal.

Kevin

_________________
I told you I'd shoot, but you didn't believe me! WHY DIDN'T YOU BELIEVE ME!?!

Well, sucks to be me. I was up against the following:
1. A mod
2. Hardcore airsofter
3. From the UK

I will have to now conjure up some new post in the Ready Line that is 95% Canadian, put a (CDN) at the end of the title, quote some Canadian laws & rules then see what happens.

Interesting enuff, the original poster kept saying no to airsoft but the the UK airsofters who are working for the Queen, (DAMM, I worked longer for the Queen with 28 years of Canadian Army service which is more than many board members have on this planet) kept bringing airsoft forward. Yes young pups, I was jumping out of airplanes when you were jumping off the school bus.

You got it brother.
Thanks to all who posted in my support. I owe you a drink.

Mike

_________________
There is nothing more impressive than a bloody big Alien wiggling on the end of a sharp stick!

I wasn't even aware it was a fight!
Certainly not something to get riled over - Like I said, if someone in Canada was looking for the best way to put a PR together, and you guys quoted CDN law at him... Ideal!

The reason folk were advising the OP here ( Sorry man, we're talking about you like you're not in the room! ) is ( IMO ) that he thought a resin replica was exempt from the VCRA laws whilst airsoft was not.
Which isn't the case, as we've now established.
So his reasoning for not wanting to go down the Airsoft route was kinda flawed.

BTW, since you mentioned being "up against me" as a mod - In discussions like this, you can generally consider my Mod Hat to be on the hook, not on my head.
I'm a user of the forums, first and foremost - And you guys are among the most-respected people here in my eyes. So please don't think for a second I'd "Pull rank" as it were... Mod-ness isn't rank ( Again, IMO ), it's something I do on occasion to help the board run as smoothly as possible.

That said, I did eventually post in the Admin area about this, to see what the rest of the Mod team thought - Because I felt that if you guys felt strongly about the issue, then it might be an idea to make a "team ruling" on where such posts should go... But I would definitely avoid ever speaking as a "lone moderator", as it were, and saying "I ARE MOD! YOU WILL OBEY!" unless someone was actually breaking forum rules/the law.

_________________
MSgt, UKCM 42nd Reg., 1st Batt. : Hadrian's Wall. UKCM

Wasteland Workshop
Props, cosplay pieces, upcycled ornamentation, and miscellanea;
For the discerning survivor of the apocalypse.
Steve Fletcher : Maker, Scavenger, and Junksmith.
linktr.ee/wastelandworkshop

I second the motion.
Doesn't take much, hm?

Having recently obtained my PAL, I'd be interested in that.

I'll settle for a sip of the rye in your secret stash.