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PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 4:12 am 
Yardbird
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Location: Portland Oregon
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So when is it best to eat? Before you work out? After you work out or is it a personal prefrence? If its before/after how long should I wait to eat/workout???

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 4:37 am 
Lifer
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I eat five times a day. I have a meal (the largest of the day for me which is lunch) two to three hours before my workout and another smaller meal about an hour after my workout.

So my typical daily meal plan is something like this (it varies slightly as I do shift work and it isn't always the same hours in the day):

7am Breakfast: usually cereal or cream of wheat and a cup of coffee

11am Mid morning meal: whole wheat bagel, cup of yogourt and cottage cheese, cup worth of grapes and two cups water

2pm Lunch: rice and breast of chicken (or tuna), can of diet pop

5pm Workout

7pm Dinner: a wrap made with either chicken or tuna, can of diet pop

10pm Last meal: three whole eggs either scrambled, poached or as an omlete with shredded cheese, but always done in the microwave, more water.

When I want to satisfy my sweet-tooth, I munch on semi-sweet chocolate chips (couple of handfuls and the taste is so overly sweet that I don't want anymore).

When I want to indulge- I indulge (about once or twice a week or so). However I never eat things like hot dogs, chicken wings, potato chips, real soda pop. I've had one hamburger in the past year. Things like pizza maybe once a month.

I used to do the "cheat day" thing. However I found that if you set a particular day of the week (say Sunday for instance) to go hog wild, you end up drving yourself nuts during the week waiting for that cheat day- you are likely to fall off the wagon and cheat anyway. You also are likely to overeat beyond excess on the cheat day which really defeats the purpose of watching your diet to begin with.

This is why I snack on the chocolate chips whenever I want to. :wink:

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 5:51 am 
Yardbird
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Location: Portland Oregon
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SSgt Burton wrote:

10pm Last meal: three whole eggs either scrambled, poached or as an omlete with shredded cheese, but always done in the microwave, more water.



This is why I snack on the chocolate chips whenever I want to. :wink:


With this meal schedule in mind, what time do you go to sleep? I've heard you shouldn't eat for at least three hours before you go to sleep.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 12:16 pm 
The Pinup
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With this meal schedule in mind, what time do you go to sleep? I've heard you shouldn't eat for at least three hours before you go to sleep.


Hey Cooter,

Don't worry about that. That really is a myth. Truly your body burns calories all day and all night. Your body doesn't 'slow' down calorie buring wise at night.

I think this myth stemmed from the fact that people like to weigh themselves first thing in the morning and if you eat a heavy meal late in the evening, then you'll obviously have food weight on you.

I'm becoming very serious about training. I am still no where near my goal, but I've decided that I'd really like to do some body modeling, meaning a healthy body, not skinny ass bikini models. So I"m not just talking out my rear here. :) :P

I'm posting an article that I think everyone will benefit from.

It's to follow this post.


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 Post subject: Measuring Your Progress
PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 12:24 pm 
The Pinup
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Read this carefully and pay attention to what he's saying. This is a great bit of information for people just beginning their transformations AND for the group of us that are struggling with our final numbers.


Measuring Your Progress
By John P. Hussman, Ph.D.

When you start your fitness program, you should take several measurements. At minimum, these should include your weight, your bodyfat reading, and your waist circumference.

There are several ways of obtaining bodyfat readings, ranging from hand-held calipers to water submersion pods. I prefer calipers. You can have somebody at a local health club do it, or you can follow the directions below. Used correctly, they allow you to monitor your own progress nicely. True, there are "bioelectrical impedance" devices that pass electrical currents through your hands or the bottom of your foot. But the measurements you'll get will vary wildly throughout the day. So while they're "objective" in the sense of giving you an exact number, they're not very consistent and require very specific conditions to be reliable.

You may wonder how it's possible to estimate bodyfat percentages just by measuring from one or two sites on your body. The reason is that the thickness of human bodyfat layers is relatively proportional. While the fat layer over the abdomen is generally thicker than the fat layer over the tricep, when you gain weight, the new fat distributes itself roughly proportional to how the existing fat is distributed. Similarly, when you lose fat, it comes off in sheets, like an onion. You cannot, cannot "spot reduce" the fat from a particular area of the body by working it more aggressively. You can certainly develop the muscles in that area through focused intensity, but fat comes off evenly from the body.

Now some calculations. Take your weight on the scale and multiply it by your bodyfat percentage. That gives you your "fat mass" (e.g. if you're 180 pounds and 25% bodyfat, 180 x .25 = 45 pounds of fat)

Next, subtract the fat mass from your total scale weight. That gives you your "fat free mass" (e.g. 180 pounds - 45 pounds of fat = 135 pounds of fat free mass).

These are the numbers you will track from week to week. What you basically want is a gradual reduction in fat mass and a stable or increasing amount of fat free mass. But be careful in how you interpret these. Notice that I've used the clinical term "fat free mass" rather than calling it "lean weight" or "muscle". The reason is that "fat free mass" includes the weight of bones, blood, water, breakfast, and the gummy bears you just ate. The measurement tools you have can't tell the difference. Very minor changes in water retention, coupled with small errors in bodyfat measurement, can make it seem that you've gained or lost an incredible amount of fat free mass, and if you jump to the conclusion it's all muscle, you'll freak out.

Day by day, you're trying to measure your progress in the mirror, on the scale, with calipers, and so on. The problem is that all of the changes are taking place under the skin, along with a lot of other things you can't see, like increased blood volume and fluid retention. Don't place too much emphasis on numbers such as scale weight, fat weight and estimated muscle gain until the changes become significant as a proportion of your body weight. Until then, it's just next to impossible to get a reliable reading, because the tools you are using all have measurement error. A meaningless two-millimeter caliper error translates into about 2.5% bodyfat, and can drive some people to tears. And as I explain on my Q&A page, the muscle gain figure can easily be off by 4% of body weight.

If you're easily frustrated, brace yourself when you step on the scale. Just on the basis of water retention, digestive contents and other factors, your scale weight is going to fluctuate by as much as 3-4% of body weight almost on a weekly basis. If you've eaten a lot of carbs, you'll tend to retain a lot of water for a couple of days. People often freak out about this, thinking they've "gained" 5 pounds because of a single free day. Conversely, people often get excited that they've lost 5 pounds over a few days, and think it's all fat. Then the scale jumps up again, and they get upset and give up on their programs. Please don't take these fluctuations seriously.

Think of it this way. A woman doing relatively well on her fitness program might be losing over 1 pound of fat a week, while gaining a fraction of a pound of muscle. So while she might be on track to lose 12-15 pounds of fat and gain a few pounds of lean muscle over 12 weeks, by the 5th week she might be looking at a scale change of less than 4 pounds. And since that's about the weight of a meal and a couple of glasses of water, she may not even see the scale move at all. This is especially true at high bodyfat levels, where shifts in water retention over a monthly cycle can be quite large. But gradually, the changes are happening anyway, as long as she doesn't give up. For women at high bodyfat levels, progress may not show for weeks at a time. The reason is that your readings will zig-zag within their downward path. If you measure from a peak in weight to a recent trough, you'll be elated at the "jump" in your progress. But other times you'll get a trough-to-peak reading and be totally frustrated. Don't extrapolate either of these impressions. Chart your numbers and measure progress from peak-to-peak or trough-to-trough.

Why measure waist circumference? Well, insulin resistant individuals often have significant visceral fat deposits in the abdominal area (fat around the organs). This depot is reduced somewhat faster than subcutaneous fat. Often neither the scale nor caliper measurements will capture the full extent of fat loss, and tracking waist circumference using a tape measure can indicate fat loss that may not be apparent otherwise. You might also keep a tight fitting skirt or pair of pants in the closet and just try putting it on every couple of weeks.

Bodyfat percentages of 6-14% for men and 12-18% for women are generally considered "lean". Those lower bounds should be respected. Women with significantly less than 12% bodyfat typically wreak havoc with their estrogen regulation, and put themselves at risk for osteoporosis. Below 6% for men and 12% for women is not healthy (a lot of nutrients rely on fat-solubility to be stored in the body). Conversely, bodybuilders only have to gain a few percent in fat in order to look unfit.

Men generally need bodyfat at about 9-11% to look "cut". That's really when you'll see that "six-pack" in the abdominals (you actually already have a six-pack - everybody does - it's just that you may need some fat reduction to show it). The percentage is closer to 14-16% for women. Physiologist Covert Bailey notes that in women, the thighs typically begin to slim noticeably at about 18% bodyfat. Think of a roll of paper towels. As you unroll it, you can take off a lot of paper and not see much effect. But as you get further along, even taking off a small amount of paper from the roll will thin that baby down to the cardboard. Depending on where you started, it may take more than a few months to get there (which is fine ).

How much muscle gain is reasonable? In general, even a fraction of a pound a week is great, and a pound a week is outstanding. If you calculate that you've gained several pounds of muscle a week, with a similarly dramatic fat loss, you've probably either overestimated your initial bodyfat level, or underestimated your current bodyfat level. As Lee Haney (who has won more consecutive Mr. Olympia titles than anyone in bodybuilding) states "The first year you train steadily, you might be fortunate enough to put on 20 pounds of muscle, but the second year it may be only 10, the third only 6, and the fourth only 4-5. Since it gets harder and harder to make gains in lean body mass, I'm happy with an average of 2-3 new pounds yearly." Muscle gains can be unusually fast for beginners, but be realistic in your goals and progress estimates.

How much fat loss is reasonable? Well, as noted in the calories section above, it's not unreasonable to target fat loss of as much as 1 to 2 lbs a week for women, and as much as 2 - 3 lbs a week for men. But be honest with yourself. You'll only get those kinds of results with planned discipline and careful monitoring of your exercise and food intake.

The Paper Towel Theory

As it turns out, you can get fairly good estimates of your bodyfat composition simply from a single skinfold, or by passing a tiny electrical current through your foot, ankle or hands. What this really means is that fat is distributed fairly precisely on the body. And while it's true that some people have larger fat deposits on some parts of their body than others, it's also true that percentage-wise, the fat on your body comes off fairly evenly.

That's important to remember when you measure your progress. See, one of the first places you're probably looking for fat loss is on those areas of your body that you think are "too fat." But in fact, that's the last place you should look, because I can guarantee that those areas are still going to look "too fat" for a little while.

Think of it this way. If you have a roll of paper towels (or a cassette tape), and you start to unravel it, you can get a good amount off of the roll before you really see a visible change. But as you get further down that roll, even taking off a little more is very apparent.

The same is true with your body. The first place you're going to see greater definition is at those areas where the fat deposits are relatively thin already. For most people, this is around the shoulders and clavicles (the two long bones that run just under your neck, connecting your two shoulders to the breast plate).

Another reason why this is important is that advertisers often prey on the belief that fat can be "spot-reduced." All the twisty ab-crunchers on the market are perfect examples. Basically, these companies get a fitness model that has followed months or years of weight training, aerobics, and proper nutrition, and have them roll back and forth in one of these things, as if they actually got in shape that way.

Or look at all the books promising to help you lose fat "for your type" - pear shaped, apple shaped, dodecahedron shaped - you name it. It's true, for example, that people who are insulin resistant tend to store more fat in the midsection, and that women tend to store more fat in the thigh area. But so what? If you lose the fat, it comes off EVERYWHERE. If a problem area looks "too fat", training that area with exercise may very well improve the definition of the underlying muscles and the overall form of that area. But it will not accelerate fat loss relative to other parts of your body.

If the body didn't lose fat uniformly, we'd all wobble around like Weebles because our relatively fixed bone and muscle structure wouldn't be able to tolerate the variation. The best way to change the size of your body is through caloric deficits. The best way to change the shape is through resistance training. The one thing you need to achieve a total physique and fitness transformation is to do EVERYTHING - aerobics, intervals, resistance training, cross-training (physiologist Covert Bailey calls these the "four food groups of exercise"), small frequent meals, high-quality protein and carbohydrates, low-glycemic nutrition, proper supplementation, water, and rest. As Shawn Phillips says, "the one thing, is everything."

So again, if you're looking for results in the mirror, look for the first signs of improved definition at those areas where muscle is relatively close to the surface. For most people, this is the upper chest and shoulder area. After two weeks, you probably won't see enormous visible changes elsewhere. But those changes are happening anyway.

You should definitely be keeping track of how your clothes feel. Go to the closet and pick out an outfit that's just a little too tight. Put it aside. You'll want to try it on occasionally. Waist measurements can also capture fat loss that isn't necessarily evident in the mirror.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 2:21 pm 
Lifer
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That's a great article Ash!

I love the part about the ab machines with fitness models. Same goes for things like BowFlex/Total Gym machines. The guys modelling those have obviously been working out for years (probably more than a decade). I watch one of those commercials and think... "There is no way they got that body with a BowFlex alone". :roll:

Just to answer Cooter's question I don't go to bed before 12am. I'm usually asleep by 12:15-12:30am and up at 6:25am. But again because of the shift work (mornings/afternoons/evenings) it varies slightly.

I wouldn't recommend eating a huge meal before going to bed- and my meals in the evening are actually the smallest of the day. But eating an hour or two before bed to get your protein requirements is no problem. If I'm tired and don't feel like cooking that late- I'll drink those three eggs raw, or have a protein shake. Raw eggs are supposed to be bad for you as they still might have bacteria that would be destroyed during cooking- but I've never had a problem (I only do this once in a while anyway).

Just remember staying in shape is about 20% workouts (maybe less even), 40% rest and 40% nutrition. People tend to think the opposite- that it's all about the workout itself.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 19, 2008 6:01 pm 
Emperor Ma'Dupe
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My 2 cents on this front as I went from 245 down to a somewhat cut 185 for sporting a Spartan at Dragon last year. The multi meals have already been mentioned. I eat 5 to 6 times a day. Get plenty of protein to be sure. My biggest challenge, after dumping soda and ice cream of course, was portion control. I was eating healtier foods but still tons of it. When I cut down to what I actually needed the fat left. Slowly, but surely.

And I plateaued big time at 220 and again at 200. Had to fight through it, tweaking meals and workouts (2 a day the last 3 months before Dragon). My workouts were never longer than 45 minutes though. And I still saw solid results. I went from pure weightlifting to functional muscle routines like you'll find at crossfit.com or gymjones.com. GJ by the way trained the Spartans for "300". I still lift for mass building a few months out of the year but the majority of my time is spent on complex movements with cardio elements thrown in i.e. burpees, bear crawls, pull ups, squats, rows and the like.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 30, 2008 2:43 am 
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Update:

Just finished a 4 week strength routine with cardio on the non-lifting days. It was really cool and will be picking it up again after DC. Here's the link.http://www.t-nation.com/article/most_recent/combination_training_8212_for_the_best_of_both_worlds

Now with 60 something days to go till DC, it's time to get cut. I'm switching to a program that consists of interval cardio every morning with weight training sessions at night, just for muscle maintenance, nothing killer.

I'm at 11% body fat now, but need to be at least 8% but aiming for 7%.

I've been gone a bit as I had to get my shit together. Now that there's been progress there, I should be around a little more.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2008 3:37 am 
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Better late then never right?

Just started with something simple, I went out and bought a new bicycle , setting it up and getting the handlebars and seat adjusted ended up riding 3/4 mile tonight.
With the wife and kids now all on bikes and a new park close at hand it will prove more incentive to keep riding at least until it snows.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 12:41 am 
Lifer
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Well yesterday I went to the gym for the first time in three weeks! :o

I always treat my vacation from work as my vacation from the gym as well. It's easy to think that your body is going to go in reverse or something and that you will never recover from the layoff.

Well your body does need a break once in a while. A week off here or there isn't going to ruin all your hard work.

But I also knew that I should take it VERY SLOW my first day back! :wink:

So I basically did half my workout for chest and arms. I also didn't really go beyond the weights I would normally warm up with (which wasn't exactly fun for my ego :lol: ).

But I survived. And my chest is feeling sore (but not ridiculous) today! :)


With the costuming season coming to an end, and winter approaching it's easy to neglect your nutritional/exercise regime. Especially with food realted holidays such as Halloween, Thanksgiving and Christmas coming up. For the past two years I've tried to make the effort to watch my diet even during those huge dinners.

It's cool to indulge a bit- just try not to go overboard. Take it easy on the gravies, butter, melted cheese, etc- these really add a lot of extra calories to that already big meal.


Soooo...

Everyone else still here? :wink: 8)

Kevin

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 3:58 am 
You there! Get me a Turkey!
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I'm still here, but the gym is gone.
My work now keeps me moving and sweating. not only that but it destroys me being able to get to the gym before they close at 8 :(

So I'm making sure I keep working hard to get my exercise while at work.

One thing.....Derek pointed out the first day in Atlanta that I looked thinner in the face....that made my day :)
Thanks Derek.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:07 am 
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i started out on my bowflex about 2 weeks brfore the con , and this time i plan to stick with it

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 12:16 pm 
He's just a grunt...
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CplTony wrote:

One thing.....Derek pointed out the first day in Atlanta that I looked thinner in the face....that made my day :)
Thanks Derek.


Youre welcome :) I got alot of comments too...made me feel great!! So, next year I plan on that Hypersleep costume with you Kev.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 1:30 pm 
Lifer
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You guys both looked a lot leaner this year!


CPL Smith wrote:
So, next year I plan on that Hypersleep costume with you Kev.



Heh! That was a last minute decision when I found the electrodes that had been hiding in my garage- I'm definitely bringing that get up from now on.

I actually planned on showing up at the table on Friday morning like that- and looking around at you guys saying "What? Doesn't everyone sleep like this?" :wink: :lol:


Kevin

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:44 pm 

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Luckily for the Maryland Group we have Farpoint in February. I have been working out and trying to eat right. I know that none of you know me but I had surgery about a year and half ago and really let myself go (using the excuse that I was still recovering).

So I have gotten back on the band wagon and started back up on Monday. I only did some cardio (45min) and water aerobics (60 min) but you have to start somewhere. Before D*C I was doing about 2hrs a day and I need to get back to that. My goal is to have some nice definition. I’m on my way, now I just need to lose some of the fat to show off the muscle underneath.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 4:50 pm 
Too Pretty to Die

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Urg. I need to workout. I would say "workout more" but I'm honest enough to admit that I... well lets just say that walking around D*C was the most exercise I've had in a while.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 5:18 pm 
Victor
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I really need to get back into my routine. I had been running regularly and doing a work out that Kevin was kind enough to put together for me and I was starting to see results.

Thing is I fell pregnant so obviously had to give up on the running and weights. Unfortunately I miscarried and over the last month or so I've put loads of weight back on. I think I'm around 170lbs now...

...and I can't believe I've just admitted that to a public forum. :lol:

The plan is to try and get back on the horse and loose some weight whilst toning up those flabby bits. According to the good ol' height/weight charts I should be around 126lbs with a BMI of 21. At the moment my BMI is about 28. :oops:

So, what the hell am I doing here surfing the 'net when I should be out there running! Wish me luck, guys!

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 11:39 pm 
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Argh. This thread popping up has made me realize how lazy I've become. I want to look like this again...

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 12:34 am 
Lifer
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How are the runs going Dom?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 12:53 am 
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I am currently motivating myself to return. It's been 2 months since my last run.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 3:10 am 
Lifer
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Okay guys and gals the first big hurdle of the season is here with Halloween (second for us Canucks- we already had Thanksgiving :wink: ).

So if you have tons of Halloween treat candy left over- here's a tip to try so you don't devour it all at once:

Put it into ziploc bags with no more than 4 or 5 treats per bag. Then ration it out to yourself- 1 bag per day (if you can hold off for more than a day all the better).

Yeah it takes self restraint- but the point is once you finish the contents of the one bag you tell yourself THAT'S IT until tomorrow. It's a little easier to stop when you have an empty bag in your hands, and have to make a conscious effort to go back to your stash. :wink:

You don't have to limit this to Halloween candy- it goes for any snack food you find yourself addicted to. This can really help with things like potato chips or any crunchy food that comes in a HUGE bag that you are able to consume in one sitting.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 02, 2008 3:06 pm 
You there! Get me a Turkey!
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I'm taking it one step further and just not eating any candy at all.

For thanksgving I'm off to my inlaws so I'll want to leave ASAP so will eat very little ;)

Then for Christmas I'm leaving the US so no processed treats for me :)

But Kev makes a great point.
Give yourself a reason to stop, make a mental of physical barrier.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 30, 2008 10:38 pm 
Victor
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Thought it was time to bump this thread again seeing as all my American chums are probably still feeling the effects of over-eating at Thanksgiving and the fact that Christmas is just a few weeks away. ;)

I've also taken the plunge and started doing the Power90 workouts. I tried the P90X but it was too much for me (I couldn't even do the warm up :oops:). Power90 seems to be much more my level. To be honest though this is my first day of working out so who knows if I'll be saying the same thing at the end of the week. :lol:

For those that don't know, the Power90 routine consists of six days of workouts (switching between a cardio and abs workout and a sculpting/weights workout) with a rest day on the seventh. There is a diet to follow as well and they try and convince you that you need their supplements. For the moment I'm just going to try the workouts and see what sort of results I get.

Wish me luck.

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 30, 2008 10:43 pm 
I don't believe it!
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Good luck Vicky.. If i had the time i would take up something like this... :(

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 30, 2008 10:47 pm 
Victor
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Country: United Kingdom
Glenn wrote:
Good luck Vicky.. If i had the time i would take up something like this... :(


Thanks!

And that's the beauty of Power90 - each workout is only 30 minutes long. Just enough to get you sweating and your heart rate up but not enough to kill you. ;)

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