The discussion of the Alien series of films and the props used in them is the aim, but if it's got Big Bugs and Big Guns, then they are welcome too!





Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 12 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Explorer MM-IV ("Gerber Clone" and Hudson's knife)
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 7:27 pm 
THAT guy
User avatar

Location: Virginia
Service Number: A03/TQ2.0.02146E1
Country: United States
Figured this knife needed its own thread. There is already some great info about it, but it is often buried at the end of other threads labeled with Gerber and Night Raider titles.


A brief "highlight" list of must-read threads regarding Hudson's knife (and by default this knife) are these 2 threads:

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=12598&hilit=gerber+chart
-This thread highlights the various types and styles of Gerber that have been produced through the years. In this thread I suggest to get a "screen accurate" gerber (correct Tooth-per inch, correct style sheath, correct handle color, and correct blade) one needed to find a 1977-79 era knife and blue the blade. Bluing the blade was actually quite common as they came with "field bluing" kits when sold new. It made so much sense...for a little while. That theory would prove short-lived!


viewtopic.php?f=3&t=13654&hilit=gerber+chart
-This thread started out focused on the modern day series of "Raider" knives as 'fill in' items, but quickly blew up everything we thought we knew about Hudson's "Gerber". Specifically screen grabs were used from the "knife trick" scene to show it wasn't a gerber at all. The hand guard was not that of a real gerber (angular contours, flat faces) and was actually that of a clone (rounded contours which tapered to a point). The MM-IV was targeted.


http://militarycarryknives.com/CopiesClones.htm
-This page highlights the various "clones" of Gerber Mk2s and there you find the candidates for Hudson's 'true' knife. I think it goes without saying the Explorer MM-IV is the top suspect. The other clones have the wrong sheath, wrong # of teeth in the serrated area, or the wrong blade material (A shiny 440 stainless blade cannot be easily darkened as it appears in the film. It is an elaborate process and only the MM-IV had a factory applied black oxide finish).

In fact, the Explorer MM-IV aces the test in every regard:
-Correct handle color and features (as screen matched in the 2nd link)
-Correct blade features which matched the screen cap'd blade (TPI, wasp, darkened blade)
-And now as these pics will show, an even more accurate Sheath than a Gerber.

Attachment:
Hudson MM-IV sheath.jpg
Hudson MM-IV sheath.jpg [ 84.53 KiB | Viewed 6667 times ]

Attachment:
20150225_192849_HDR.jpg
20150225_192849_HDR.jpg [ 188.32 KiB | Viewed 6667 times ]


In the screen grabs of the sheath you see "straight" side walls, not curved inward mimicking the 'wasp' of the blade like on the Gerber.
You also see a perfect match for the retaining flap/tab. The taper has already started to a point by the time the tab reaches the metal 'button' on the MM-IV, unlike the gerber which has a less subtle taper that starts after the button. Also the button sits very close to the edge of the opening on Hudson's/MM-IV sheath as opposed to further down on the Gerber sheath.


I am not saying all Gerbers need to be removed from costumes. Far from it. They are still great "close enough" items :wink: It is fair and logical to say the Explorer played the character of a Gerber even, so do what you have been doing! I just want to slap this nail in the topic.


Also, even though they don't necessarily prove anything knew, I took these pics of the MM-IV side by side with a 1979 gerber, so figured I'd post em.
Attachment:
20150225_192937_HDR.jpg
20150225_192937_HDR.jpg [ 264.04 KiB | Viewed 6667 times ]

It is interesting to me the MM-IV is just a tiny bit bigger. Felt heavier too.

Attachment:
20150225_193022_HDR.jpg
20150225_193022_HDR.jpg [ 168.42 KiB | Viewed 6667 times ]

Attachment:
20150225_193141_HDR.jpg
20150225_193141_HDR.jpg [ 219.02 KiB | Viewed 6667 times ]


The higher start to the serrations also matches the screen caps.

Fun stuff.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Explorer MM-IV ("Gerber Clone" and Hudson's knife)
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 10:18 pm 
User avatar

Location: Wolfsburg Niedersachsen
Service Number: A12/TQ2.0.02132E1
Country: Germany
Well that is just amazing,thanks so much for sharing this has just answered all my questions about this knife,Cheers mate.Do you now what kniffe hicks used on his armour?



Neil

_________________
Cpl N.Storey A12/TQ2.0.02132E1


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Explorer MM-IV ("Gerber Clone" and Hudson's knife)
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 10:29 pm 
THAT guy
User avatar

Location: Virginia
Service Number: A03/TQ2.0.02146E1
Country: United States
schotti wrote:
Well that is just amazing,thanks so much for sharing this has just answered all my questions about this knife,Cheers mate.Do you now what kniffe hicks used on his armour?

Neil


Sure thing.

Hicks had a "Scalemead Survival" knife which is the 'shiny blade' version of an "Explorer Night Raider". The only difference being the "Night Raider" has a blackened blade (and of course the etching that says scalemead/explorer). Most people find Night Raiders as they are far more common.

*Apone (right strap under holster), Vaz (right boot), Drake (left boot), Crowe (left pelvis on belt), and Frost (left hip) also all carried that knife.
**None of the modern "Raider" series are screen accurate, btw. Neither the "Raider I", Raider II, nor Raider III have the screw cap at the bottom


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Explorer MM-IV ("Gerber Clone" and Hudson's knife)
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2015 11:46 pm 
User avatar

Location: Wolfsburg Niedersachsen
Service Number: A12/TQ2.0.02132E1
Country: Germany
Thats amazing thanks for the Info.Looks like i have a Challenge on my hands to try and find One of them.

Cheers

Neil

_________________
Cpl N.Storey A12/TQ2.0.02132E1


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 10:53 am 
AKKURAZI
User avatar

Location: Herne, Ruhr area
Country: Germany
Very extensive and very helpful information, thanks man! Now to find that elusive Gerber clone in Germany. Neil, if you should find a source... ;)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Explorer MM-IV ("Gerber Clone" and Hudson's knife)
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 3:03 pm 
User avatar

Location: Wolfsburg Niedersachsen
Service Number: A12/TQ2.0.02132E1
Country: Germany
I Certainly will let you now.

Neil

_________________
Cpl N.Storey A12/TQ2.0.02132E1


Last edited by schotti on Fri Feb 27, 2015 6:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 5:34 pm 
Moderator & screen used
User avatar

Location: United Kingdom
Service Number: A08/TQ1.0.02136E1
Country: United Kingdom
Top stuff! I will of course have to find one of these to compliment my Hudson armour. :)

Harry

_________________
Image
http://www.facebook.com/TheHHACA - @TheHHACA


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Explorer MM-IV ("Gerber Clone" and Hudson's knife)
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 6:58 pm 
User avatar

Location: Wolfsburg Niedersachsen
Service Number: A12/TQ2.0.02132E1
Country: Germany
Have a Look here.There sold out at the Moment.I'm going to give them a Ring on monday to ask if they might be able to get more in.
There is a Button for english so no Problems for you all.Look under Tools and then knives,and then under fixed Blade knives,the knife is on page 7.

http://www.asmc.de

Neil

_________________
Cpl N.Storey A12/TQ2.0.02132E1


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Explorer MM-IV ("Gerber Clone" and Hudson's knife)
PostPosted: Fri Feb 27, 2015 8:49 pm 
AKKURAZI
User avatar

Location: Herne, Ruhr area
Country: Germany
schotti wrote:
Have a Look here.There sold out at the Moment.I'm going to give them a Ring on monday to ask if they might be able to get more in.
There is a Button for english so no Problems for you all.Look under Tools and then knives,and then under fixed Blade knives,the knife is on page 7.

http://www.asmc.de

Neil


Thanks, great link, great find. It is the Gerber though mind you, and the recent version at that, not the "clone" used for the movie and highlighted in this thread.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Explorer MM-IV ("Gerber Clone" and Hudson's knife)
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 1:47 pm 
User avatar

Location: Wolfsburg Niedersachsen
Service Number: A12/TQ2.0.02132E1
Country: Germany
Thats right it's Not the clone but it's interesting anyway.

Neil

_________________
Cpl N.Storey A12/TQ2.0.02132E1


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Explorer MM-IV ("Gerber Clone" and Hudson's knife)
PostPosted: Sat Feb 28, 2015 1:55 pm 
AKKURAZI
User avatar

Location: Herne, Ruhr area
Country: Germany
schotti wrote:
Thats right it's Not the clone but it's interesting anyway.

Neil


Yup, it is. I can't tell if they offer a fair deal or not, I am totally new to knife pricing. ;)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: Explorer MM-IV ("Gerber Clone" and Hudson's knife)
PostPosted: Mon Jan 23, 2017 3:01 pm 
THAT guy
User avatar

Location: Virginia
Service Number: A03/TQ2.0.02146E1
Country: United States
Got some better pics of this MM-IV. Figured I'd just stash em here.
(isolated from grabs by Willie and Moosh, thanks guys!)

Decent shot of the contoured and pointed hilt (unlike the flat angular hilt of the gerber)
Attachment:
Hudson's MMIV Hilt 1.jpg
Hudson's MMIV Hilt 1.jpg [ 79.51 KiB | Viewed 4025 times ]


Better shot of the sheath (again, shorter retaining tab, button snap placement closer to hilt, straight side walls)
Attachment:
Hudson Knife 2.jpg
Hudson Knife 2.jpg [ 71.27 KiB | Viewed 4025 times ]



Another fun fact: If you look close, it appears that Hudson's "ab pad" strap is run through the belt loop of the sheath. I had always wondered about how he secured it to his strap. The tape at the top looks fairly obvious, but I wondered how he kept it from flapping about. Securing it at the bottom this way would explain it.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Forum locked This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 12 posts ] 



You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to: