The discussion of the Alien series of films and the props used in them is the aim, but if it's got Big Bugs and Big Guns, then they are welcome too!





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 Post subject: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 2:25 pm 
(Sorry guys but I feel this important)


The UK will ban the manufacture and importation of replica firearms (yes, even 'movie props') in October 2007. Were you aware?

The airsoft fraternity have lobbied and gained an exemption - i.e. they will be able to continue to collect replica firearms.

But what can pure collectors do?

From the "Violent Crime Reduction Act 2006" www.opsi.gov.uk/ACTS/acts...--e.htm#36

Quote:
Quote:36 Manufacture, import and sale of realistic imitation firearms

(1) A person is guilty of an offence if-

(a) he manufactures a realistic imitation firearm;
(b) he modifies an imitation firearm so that it becomes a realistic imitation firearm;
(c) he sells a realistic imitation firearm; or
(d) he brings a realistic imitation firearm into Great Britain or causes one to be brought into Great Britain.


Quote:
Quote:38 Meaning of "realistic imitation firearm"

(1) In sections 36 and 37 "realistic imitation firearm" means an imitation firearm which-

(a) has an appearance that is so realistic as to make it indistinguishable, for all practical purposes, from a real firearm; and
(b) is neither a de-activated firearm nor itself an antique.

(2) For the purposes of this section, an imitation firearm is not (except by virtue of subsection (3)(b)) to be regarded as distinguishable from a real firearm for any practical purpose if it could be so distinguished only-

(a) by an expert;
(b) on a close examination; or
(c) as a result of an attempt to load or to fire it.


Your thoughts?
 
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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:06 pm 
This is just a pathetic cash in on knee jerking with a new bill with NO thoughts actually committed to it.

Great to hear the Airsofters managed to get an exemption I must admit.

Would it be considered late in the day for re-enactors,Prop collectors,Scifi collectors etc to start a campaign to also exempt themselves?

After all a local Bobbie,Civvie could easily mistake a LOT of Scifi movie props/Replicas as actual firearms.

Hell I recall back in the early 90s a friend being nicked for waving a Super Soaker about (Cause he was dressed in Black).

I think it`s truely pathetic how the Goverment tackle the lawabidding folk instead of the true issue of Illegal firearms on our shores.

On another note connected with this New law,How does that affect the 2012 fiasco?
After all isn`t shooting an event? So all the International enteries will be arrested once they land on British soil,so England gets Gold by default?

So how long before a lego made 1:1 weapon will get you 10 years in the slammer?

Ja
PVT.
STEAD,J "Axeman"
A06/TQ1.0.22140E1
UKCM


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:14 pm 
Quote:
Quote:for all practical purposes


Something about this part really bugs me. If it was a replica, wouldn't it be "impractical" ie. Pay a lot of money for something that DOESN'T work.
What is the driver behind this ban?
Image
What are you doing with a gun in space?


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 3:27 pm 
Well there`s an increase on gangs shooting each other in the UK (& of course the parents always state their child wasn`t a gang member). Also an increase of Police Officers being shot at too (A lot don`t even make the news).

So someone had the brain fart to ban all immitation firearms thus real guns will become affected by this new law & thus useless to shoot others.

Our Politicians are truely in a class of their own you know.
It`s said that Politicians & Prime Ministers sometimes say:-
"I see REAL people".

Ja
PVT.
STEAD,J "Axeman"
A06/TQ1.0.22140E1
UKCM


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:42 pm 
It's important to note that re-enactors and the theatre industry had an exemption from the start. "Collectors" of prop guns don't really need them to conduct themselves, so they lose. Airsofters have an exemption through policy so their sport may continue. As we are collectors (unless we are also airsofters, theatre workers or re-enactors), we do not get one. I think it's fair within the scope of the Act.

However, the Act *IS* a knee-jerk reaction and is already allowed for within the law for the purposes it's aimed at. All it is doing is giving more people potentially arrestable on the British streets. Anyone who now has a prop firearm is now equal game for fines and imprisonment as someone with an actual firearm. That said, that was the case since 2003 - while an understandable legal shift, it was quite unnecessary.


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:01 pm 
I've decided to make this thread sticky as it's obviously a very important issue that has the potential to affect us all.

Harry
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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:24 pm 
Thank you, Harry. :)
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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:29 pm 
This is bad news indeed.

What happens now with future conventions? Are we aloud PR's ect. ?


Bri:evil:
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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:33 pm 
As I understand it, ownership will remain legal.

But then again, this government has 'creeping' policies. One minute they take away our right to make or import - the next it'll be a complete ban on ownership...

Mark my words on that.

Best contact the police or local authorities for that particular question. :)
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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 7:30 pm 
Nuts. I guess everyone will have to resort to importing real firearms, now. j/k


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 8:00 pm 
So what are the Marines supposed to use at the Scifi weekend?
harsh language?

Maybe as already said here,it`ll come down to speaking to a Police officer who Has a brain & not one who just say`s no.

So I guess Star Wars uniformed fans will have an interesting time come July then.

Ja
PVT.
STEAD,J "Axeman"
A06/TQ1.0.22140E1
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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 8:24 pm 
The new legislation is specific to the importation, rather than the ownership of "Realistic imitation firearms".

There's a SLIM chance that it could be argued that Pulse Rifles and Stormtrooper Blasters are NOT RIFs, but I on't think it would hold water, as the definition is the handily-for-the-government-ly vague "Any item that could be reasonably mistaken by a member of the public as a firearm".

Our best bet is to either use Airsoft capable Pulse Rifles... Or try to get the UKCM set up as a re-enactment group so we can keep buying Matsu gear ;)

At worst, we have someone who runs an Airsoft site act as an importation point for Matsu and other static PRs.
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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 8:43 pm 
Is there a proceure that we'd have to go through to set ourselves (the UKCM) up as a re-enactment group? By that I mean do we have to officially apply for re-enactment group status for example?

If, as I suspect, there isn't a procedure then we are one already! :)

Harry

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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:10 pm 
Bloody good point Harry, no wonder we made you Colonel ;)

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Quote:
Quote:A man may fight for many things: his country, his principles, his friends, the glistening tear on the cheek of a golden child. But personally I'd mud wrestle my own mother for a ton of cash, an amusing clock, and a sack of French porn.


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:18 pm 
I am not sure if we'd be classified as a re-enactment group. Considering links to films, I would argue we'd be more likely to link ourselves with theatrical work.


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:30 pm 
Let's cover both bases; could we call ourseves a 'theatrical re-enactment' group maybe?
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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:55 pm 
I don't think it works that way - re-enactment of a movie would be very different to historical re-enactment. I'd say we'd need to thrash things out with a member of the Home Office to work out what our classification would be.


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 8:43 am 
Re-enactment does not need be connected with movies at all.
I`ve got around almost 20 years in re-enactment under my belt (medieval & 16th century) & can easily check with those who run,if you want to proceed in that manner?

I think as already said the possible problem maybe as these are Historic groups,though with that there has been an increase of Modern Military re-enactment groups. This could actually work for us.
We could pass ourselves off as a "Colonial Marine Living History of the Future" group?

With that,we would put on shows where we show drill,weapons handling,lifestyle,weapons & kit layouts when at general shows (any of this sound familiar already? ;) ).

As said I`ll check with some folk on the exact requirements to be an offical Re-enactment group. As I`ve always been there mainly for the twatting folk :D

Ja

PVT.
STEAD,J "Axeman"
A06/TQ1.0.22140E1
UKCM


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 11:40 am 
The problem there is that if the UKCM were given dispensation, that could set a dangerous legal precedent - who knows what potential risks "future re-enactment" could potentially bring in the eyes of the police or the government.

As I said - talking to the Home Office would probably be the best bet to establish exactly what we are and where we stand. If it's unfavourable... well, if you don't want hassle, I guess we'd better get our orders in for October.


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 12:11 pm 
I'd better get started on my Pulse Rifle and DP L85 then since I've only got until October to finish them both befor I'll be breaking the law.

What a f***ing joke!
I know who I won't be voting for in the local elections on Thursday.


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 12:15 pm 
Re-enactment groups.

Dom- you heard of anything like that here? ;)

For anyone unfamiliar, Canada banned all replica firearms (including airsoft) back in 1998.

So far the only loophole (for airsoft at least) is that if the main body/receiver of the device is made of clear plastic, it is not considered a replica and is allowable. However altering said plastic would be forbidden.

If you guys actually do get something going- it might be worth looking into for us over here.

Kevin

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"I know I'm human. And if you were all these things, then you'd just attack me right now, so some of you are still human. This thing doesn't want to show itself, it wants to hide inside an imitation. If it takes us over, then it has no more enemies, nobody left to kill it. And then it's won."

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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 12:35 pm 
That stinks Kevin & God forbid we`ll truely go down that path.

A few years back the Goverment actually went to ban all Black powder weapons (Flintlocks,cannons etc),which would have crippled the UKs Re-Enactment groups (Civil War aka Sealed Knot Society,US civil War,16th cent etc).
Thankfully common sense took over & apart from more Police checks on storage, that`s been it.

It`s truely getting strange over here due to ignorance & a lack of will to tackle the actual Armed (Real Firearms) criminals instead of Law abiding citizens with replicas/prop or otherwise.

So how do you guys get by the Banned Replica Firearms law with the PRs? Any tips for us Brit`s & our impending doom of stupidity?

Ja
PVT.
STEAD,J "Axeman"
A06/TQ1.0.22140E1
UKCM


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 12:58 pm 
I'm glad to see this board is taking this seriously. Some boards I could mention don't seem to realise the gravity of the situation...
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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 1:12 pm 
Although to be fair, the general feeling seems to be that this is a knee jerk reaction and that the government are attempting to combat "real" weapons problems.
This isn't the case though. The majority of firearms related offenses are commited with replica firearms. It is these offenses which they are trying to stop.
They may be pretty stupid, but not so much to think that banning replica's will have an effect on live weapons offenses.

Granted though it does suck for those of us who have no intention of using our replica's for unlawfull purposes but from their persepctive how do you prevent unlawful use of a replica firmarm yet still leave everything open for the rest of us?
It's an impossible situation.


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 Post subject: Re: The UK bans the import of replica weapons/props
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2007 1:22 pm 
Hello folks

Well I have spoken to the Home Office to see what the UKCM would be officially classified as...

The person I spoke to said we would be more likely to be classed as a theatrical group.

I have been asked to send an e-mail which would be passed to someone who dealt specifically with this new act who would be able to tell us what classification the UKCM would be classed as.

I will send out an e-mail today or tomorrow.

As a after though, there is a Rules and Regs section to the UKCM site, I might daft out some rules and regs in the next week which will show that UKCM members adhere to set rules about the use of replica/initation firearms.

If anyone disagrees with this, let me know, but in the long run we might have to consider setting rules out in stone and in the public domain purely to save us grief.

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Quote:
Quote:A man may fight for many things: his country, his principles, his friends, the glistening tear on the cheek of a golden child. But personally I'd mud wrestle my own mother for a ton of cash, an amusing clock, and a sack of French porn.


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