The Aliens Legacy
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Question About USCM Canon
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Author:  sgtmonroe [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 8:22 am ]
Post subject:  Question About USCM Canon
Just curious, what is the consensus when it comes to material [printed and filmed] that is considered canon? Specifically in regards to the USCM. This is besides, of course, the original version of the film.
Author:  SSgt Burton [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
You are probably going to get a different opinion with each post on this question. :lol:

Personally- the Technical Manual has become the main source of reference aside from the film itself. I don't know that it is accepted as canon or not (especially since we discovered a big boo-boo in it recently).

I don't accept comics or novels as canon- the RPG is borderline.

I'm interested to hear everyone's responses though.
Author:  nick-a-tron [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
kev what was the big boo-boo?
Author:  Fal Bowden [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
nick-a-tron wrote:
kev what was the big boo-boo?


The colour of the USCM delta.
Author:  Osmotic [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 12:36 pm ]
Post subject: 
As Kev said you’ll get several different views on this and no particular one is right. It’s very much an each to his own type of thing.

Personally I can only really see the actual film as cannon as the rest of the information available is essentially someone’s imagination after the fact.
Author:  SgtTony [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 1:13 pm ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
How long is a piece of string?

Twice the distance from the centre to either end ;)

I'd say movies are canon.
While the Tech Manual is agreat source of information is also contains a lot of 'other' information not seen in the movies.
But for movie reference it can't be beat.
Author:  sgtmonroe [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:53 pm ]
Post subject: 
In regards to the "Technical Manual", which personally I have a number of issues with ... has anyone heard from, spoke with, or ever corresponded with Lee B-Wood?
Author:  friendlyskies [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
I met him briefly at the Alien Convention in 1999. He gave a talk I think though I don't remember much of it.

Darren
Author:  Adonis [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:57 pm ]
Post subject: 
Issues? Sounds serious. Care to elaborate?
Author:  Mike Rush [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
I swapped emails with him a few years ago when some here were trying to nail down the details of the 'PIG' weapon shown in his manual.

He helped to fill in some of the details, which was quite a pleasant surprise considering how long it was since he wrote the book!
Author:  clanger68 [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 8:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
For me 'Canon' is the films.

Novels, video games, comics, toys, etc are all fun but, for me personally, not 'canon'.

However you'd really have to define what 'canon' is before you can decide what is or isn't, if you see what I mean. :shock:

Gawd, my head hurts! :)

It's all good though!

Andy
Author:  Adonis [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 8:29 pm ]
Post subject: 
Cool... So... Clangerr send me all your non-canon items then. :wink:
Author:  Outcry27 [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 8:32 pm ]
Post subject: 
As said by a few others, I consider "Canon" to be the movies, followed closely by the Tech Manual. I don't really think the manual itself is canon, but it's pretty damn close to it, and considering that it's the only source of info we have on a lot of the USCM gear I think it's a great place to start.

Anything else (novels, comics, games) is fun and cool, but not canon. 8)
Author:  sgtmonroe [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:13 pm ]
Post subject: 
AdonisSniper wrote:
Issues? Sounds serious. Care to elaborate?


I have not been following the circle [and have been out] of ALIEN/S collectors since about 1994. Back in 1988-89 I wrote an ALIEN/S fanzine that carried on until around 1993-94. I was in contact with a number of collectors [Ed Maggiani comes to mind - he and I used to gab for hours on end] and fans from the UK [back then we had to do everything the old fashioned way - via the Post Office]. I also had contact with a few members of the film crew as well as Bill Paxton [Texans never forget where they are from] and Tip Tipping [until his death - RIP - then I frequently corresponded with his girlfriend].

During the latter part of the fanzine's life I became Lee B-Wood's major antagonist. I completely disagreed with what he was doing at the time. Of course, during this time period he was writing the so-called "Technical Readouts" in the UK ALIENS comic/magazine. I wrote a number of letters to them protesting the content. At some point I wrote a "bad review" [what today would be called a "flame"] in my fanzine about his extrapolations on the pulse-rifle, smart-gun, and the obviously "stolen" artwork [copied directly from the likes of Malcolm McGregor] plus the fact the term "Space Marines" kept popping up [uggggh - a pet peeve of mine].

A few months later Lee wrote me, what one could call, an apology letter. A subscriber in the UK had forwarded a copy of my fanzine to him and I guess he felt it necessary to try and defend his stance on why he had done what he did. This would have been around late 93 early 94. He also spoke about the grand plans for the "Technical Manual" that was currently in the works. He also asked for some input.

To put it simply...it is FAR from what was originally planned!!!
Author:  Adonis [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:17 pm ]
Post subject: 
Understandable. But it is what it is. It's all we have. Plus it goes for gonzo money on the secondary market.

I would love to see an updated Tech Manual, but it's doubtful that such a thing would be done.
Author:  Dan AKA [ Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:55 pm ]
Post subject: 
I have a personal list of the order I consider canon.

Alien
Aliens
Alien 3
Colonial Marine Technical Manual
Aliens Adventure Game
Aliens Novels
Aliens Comic Books
Aliens Ressurection
Aliens Versus Predator Novels
Aliens Versus Predator Comic Books
Aliens Versus Predator (PC)
Aliens Versus Predator 2 (PC)
Aliens Versus Predator 1
Aliens Versus Predator: Requrium

Just my taste.
Author:  SSgt Burton [ Thu Apr 17, 2008 12:23 am ]
Post subject: 
Yes it really does boil down to what your definition of "canon" is.

Boiled down- the USCM as seen in Aliens is the creation of James Cameron. A canon "purirst" could say that unless a particular novel/PC game or whatnot had JC as a collaborator (or his blessing so to speak) then it is not canon- it is extrapolation.

I still believe the Tech Manual is a good read though. :)

Easiest comparison would be Star Wars- everything that George Lucas directly worked on (the films, cartoon series, dvd extras) and everything that has been approved by him (novels, comics, games et al) are considered canon.

So again going back to the USCM- the only canon source is the film "Aliens". But that would be from a purist's perspective. Not that there's anything wrong with that. :wink:
Author:  JP05 [ Thu Apr 17, 2008 12:48 am ]
Post subject: 
for me...
canon = seen on screen. Everything else is expanded universe.
Author:  Adonis [ Thu Apr 17, 2008 12:53 am ]
Post subject: 
If we want to get really technical... Canon is just Aliens. No Alien, no Alien3.

All USCM stuff is only seen in one movie. period.


Maybe... just maybe.... AlienRes, since there are military types and the old AvP CCG did list them as Marines. But that was a non-canon source... oy.
Author:  Harry Harris [ Thu Apr 17, 2008 1:21 am ]
Post subject: 
Quote:
for me...
canon = seen on screen. Everything else is expanded universe.

That's my exactly definition too.

Harry
Author:  SSgt Burton [ Thu Apr 17, 2008 1:25 am ]
Post subject: 
That's because you own everything seen on screen Harry. :lol:

(That was a joke).
Author:  Harry Harris [ Thu Apr 17, 2008 1:47 am ]
Post subject: 
:lol:

I wish!

I'm still waiting for my older self to come back in a time machine to tell me that I've (he's) gone back to 1986 and bought EVERYTHING from Aliens. Also that I invested in IBM and Apple back when they started and now I own the HHACA museum. Free entry and drinks to all AL board members! ;)

Harry
Author:  springer69 [ Thu Apr 17, 2008 11:25 am ]
Post subject: 
Harry Harris wrote:
Quote:
for me...
canon = seen on screen. Everything else is expanded universe.

That's my exactly definition too.

Harry


I agree with this as well. My personal standpoint on props and replicas is that we are the unofficial/part time/whatever real life curators of a great legacy of films and so the onus on us should be to portray what was seen in the films to the best of our abilities.

Where people choose to veer off from that to pursue non canon or EU projects then it is our responsibility to ensure those of a lesser knowledge ( at con's or on forums etc ) are made aware of that, otherwise the waters between 'on screen' and EU become muddied and we risk doing these movies a dis-service.

:xeno:

Chris
Author:  SSgt Burton [ Thu Apr 17, 2008 2:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
springer69 wrote:
Where people choose to veer off from that to pursue non canon or EU projects then it is our responsibility to ensure those of a lesser knowledge ( at con's or on forums etc ) are made aware of that, otherwise the waters between 'on screen' and EU become muddied and we risk doing these movies a dis-service.


Hmmm... I was going to post a reply in which I believed that was an elitest comment- however I believe it is a case of the "cultural differences" Oz mentioned.

It is my understanding (and please forgive me if I am wrong) that one of the goals of the UKCM is to be offically classified as a re-enactment group. Thereby allowing its members to legally import RIFs into the UK.

If that is the case- then yes- the uniforms should attempt to replicate what is seen on screen as closely as possible.

But like I said- I could be way off.

Over here however- I'm doing this for fun. I don't feel I should be obligated to inform the public that my uniform is non-canon or EU. If someone asks if my PIG was in the film- I say no, but was briefly mentioned as a line in the movie (even saying that is stretching it).


Now someone has to build a sonic-electronic ballbreaker. :wink:
Author:  Mole [ Thu Apr 17, 2008 3:00 pm ]
Post subject: 
SSgt Burton wrote:
Now someone has to build a sonic-electronic ballbreaker. :wink:


I got a sharp stick. Does that count as canon? ;)

IMHO if we're talking about the USCM then you have to go by whatever was seen in the movie. EU canon is anything in the tech manual (and then the adventure game followed by other written material).

Personally I couldn't care less if someone wants to costume something mentioned in one of the novels. And if I wanted to wear pink armour then I'd hope no one would have issues with that either.

If you want to be a canon-nazi go join the 501st. ;)
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