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 Post subject: Hand welder parts/nozzles
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 1:24 am 
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Location: Luton, Bedfordshire
Service Number: A08/TQ1.0.62145E1
Country: United Kingdom
Picked up a hand welder and the welding nozzle (both sides) are missing. Any idea where I can pick up replacements? The hand welder has been cast with a screw thread each side so screwing them on is an option.

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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 1:32 am 
Harvester of Sorrow
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Location: Lancashire (Wirral born)
Service Number: A04/TQ1.0.32156E1
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Won't real welder nozzles work? (I don't have a clue but I know they screw off!)

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 Post subject: Re: Hand welder nozzles
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 12:27 pm 
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Location: UK all the way
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I guess it depends on the cast you've got and the thread but given the option I'd use a real one. (Ebay or local weldy type shops)


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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 1:06 pm 
THAT guy
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Location: Virginia
Service Number: A03/TQ2.0.02146E1
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88reaper88 wrote:
Won't real welder nozzles work? (I don't have a clue but I know they screw off!)


Forgive my long winded answer that is about to happen, but this happens to be an area I actually know stuff about! Do you guys know if "real ones" were even used? And from what kind of welder? The hand welder was always a cool thing to me, but in the last few years in the welding supply industry has raised more questions than answers about this device!

Real welder parts are like car parts in that there are dozens of brands with dozens of models so there are literally hundreds of possible parts. These companies want you to buy their product and replacement parts, so the brands are by design not interchangeable with each other. Plus, like cars, the companies release the 'new model' of a machine series every 3 -5 years to keep the line fresh, often updating the parts/consumables. So even within a brand AND within a machine line, its no guarantee the parts from the older model fit the newer ones. So finding a match will be very tough, if not impossible 'blind'.

Plus, I'm not sure what they used for filming, but the hand welders have fascinated me because they "shouldnt" work! I suspect it was not a 'real' welder part even back then. Oxy/Acetylene torches have the ability to both cut and fuse metal, but they use a burning flame that is accelerated with a stream of oxygen. When cutting, this oxygen stream is jacked up so that oxidizes the metal instantly (not truly 'melting' as most think :wink: ). When "welding" with the torch, the fuel gas and oxygen mix are closer to even as you do melt the sides and apply a filler metal to close the gaps. And the big difference is the cutting tip and welding tips are very different! You have to change them to switch processes. So with no fuel gas, no filler metals, no changing of heads when switching from cutting to welding, plus the distinctive sound of electrical crackle, I am leaning toward avoiding any idea of a 'flame torch'.

Now plasma torches make the most sense for cutting. Plasma needs only compressed air and electricity to cut. But plasma doesnt "weld". It can gouge, in that when the arc is broadened and tip components changed it can't cut, and instead "washes" the surface by melting the areas around it, but the penetration is far less so you can't really get a good "fuse" of the two sides. If they are mini MIG or STICK torches, then again, a filler metal is being applied (only with an electrical arc instead of flame heat), and they absolutely would weld...just not cut.

But those are just my ramblings about the plausibility of such a device. The obvious answer is, "its the future. Probably something new that isn't out today" (which I, of course, accept!). But to make a long story short, the point is I suspect very few, if any, real welding parts were used. If they were, we need to know the brand and model # they came off before having a prayer to track down the parts that would thread on 'plug and play' style.


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 Post subject: Re: Hand welder nozzles
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 1:17 pm 
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Location: UK all the way
Country: United Kingdom
Agreed, however he can just buy one he likes the look of a glue it on the front. :D

On a side note I'll try to dig out some captures but the nozzles used on screen are remarkably close to ones we used at work. I suspect in reality it was just a dressed up MiG/TiG with the gas pipes hidden with camera work. But like you say finding the very actual one used would be very hard indeed.

Edit: Also note what most people see as the nozzle is actually a Nozzle shroud that fits around the copper nozzle on a working welder.

Image Part F


Last edited by Osmotic on Thu May 02, 2013 2:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 2:02 pm 
Harvester of Sorrow
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Location: Lancashire (Wirral born)
Service Number: A04/TQ1.0.32156E1
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Well you know what I mean...

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 Post subject: Re: Hand welder nozzles
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 2:05 pm 
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Location: UK all the way
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Yes, I'd just pick one of Ebay that looks good. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Hand welder nozzles
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 2:21 pm 
THAT guy
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Location: Virginia
Service Number: A03/TQ2.0.02146E1
Country: United States
I think these arent too shabby. 2.25" (5.6cm). Well def need to be glued though (They are friction fit, no threads).

NOZZLE 128535.jpg
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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 2:24 pm 
Harvester of Sorrow
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Location: Lancashire (Wirral born)
Service Number: A04/TQ1.0.32156E1
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You need a bullet casing type one, that tapers into a smaller diameter:

http://www.harryharris.com/welder.htm

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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 2:26 pm 
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Location: Virginia
Service Number: A03/TQ2.0.02146E1
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88reaper88 wrote:
You need a bullet casing type one, that tapers into a smaller diameter:

http://www.harryharris.com/welder.htm


Ah yes, of course. Hmmm...


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 Post subject: Re: Hand welder nozzles
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 3:30 pm 
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Location: Virginia
Service Number: A03/TQ2.0.02146E1
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You know it almost looks like they jammed the guts of a #17 tig torch in there.

The nozzle looks like a #5 (part# 10N49 regardless of brand. TIG is the only welding process where most part# are actually standardized)

BUT...that would likely mean lots of modification. Also TIG nozzles are ceramic, so wouldnt be nearly as durable. But they are DIRT cheap. Like $2 a nozzle cheap.

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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 3:35 pm 
Mad Cat
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I wouldn't go by that picture. That's a Marco Enterprise welder and is wildly inaccurate.

The one that FNG sold, which is also the one Spat now sells, is much closer.

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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 3:58 pm 
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Location: Virginia
Service Number: A03/TQ2.0.02146E1
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Dropshipbob wrote:
I wouldn't go by that picture. That's a Marco Enterprise welder and is wildly inaccurate.

The one that FNG sold, which is also the one Spat now sells, is much closer.


Well damn. Thought I was on to something...


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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 4:26 pm 
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Location: Sunny Cornwall
Country: United Kingdom
Even going by the one that Spat sells, the TIG Nozzles do look much more like the jobbies used.

The rear section could just be a shorty rod holder.

The main handle section could have easily been something like a paint gun handle or an oxy torch handle, with the bits just mackled together.

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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 6:21 pm 
Harvester of Sorrow
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The main body is some form of camera accessory can't remember which.

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 Post subject: Re: Hand welder nozzles
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 6:38 pm 
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Location: Hamburg
Service Number: A03/TQ3.0.12136E1
Country: Germany
Yes, 88reaper88 is right. It was a HAMA "pistol grip" to hold small cameras.
See Vito's build topic (can't find the link ad hoc) for details.

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 Post subject: Re: Hand welder nozzles
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 7:12 pm 
You tell me man, I only work here.
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Location: Los Angeles
Country: United States
I have the actual welding torch brand that was used in the movie.

I can post some picts later tonight or tomorrow.

EDIT: Have a pict, here you go:
Image

It's a UK brand, the name escapes me at the moment. I'm out of town at the moment.


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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 7:23 pm 
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Location: Sunny Cornwall
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Bigbisont can take a bow...

that's definitely a TIG torch.

The brand itself is probably a little immaterial, they are all pretty similar, especially the head part.

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 Post subject: Re: Hand welder nozzles
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 7:26 pm 
THAT guy
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Location: Virginia
Service Number: A03/TQ2.0.02146E1
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Noble wrote:
I have the actual welding torch brand that was used in the movie.

I can post some picts later tonight or tomorrow.

EDIT: Have a pict, here you go:
Image

It's a UK brand, the name escapes me at the moment. I'm out of town at the moment.



Well I'll be damned. Tig torch it is. I actually still am looking forward to hearing the brand as that is really a unique back-cap on that thing.


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 Post subject: Re: Hand welder nozzles
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 7:47 pm 
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Location: UK all the way
Country: United Kingdom
Cool, would love to know what brand and part No that is. :)


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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 7:52 pm 
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Location: Sunny Cornwall
Country: United Kingdom
Yeah, it's like a short/medium length back-cap.

Having a bit of a nose about, I can only find either short.. or medium.

Could it have been a modified Medium? Just cut down and rounded out a little on the end?

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PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 11:32 pm 
Harvester of Sorrow
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Location: Lancashire (Wirral born)
Service Number: A04/TQ1.0.32156E1
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I don't know anything about these but could it be some sort of protective cap they put on to ship it?

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PostPosted: Fri May 03, 2013 7:54 am 
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Location: Sunny Cornwall
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I doubt it, it's not really a damageable part.
When the torches are shipped, they are in bits and this is normally just in the pack.

it was either modded, or just an odd-ball shape from back in the 80's, which is very possible.

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 Post subject: Re: Hand welder nozzles
PostPosted: Fri May 03, 2013 2:39 pm 
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Location: Germany
The correct model of the TIG torch for the welder is an Interlas 121 or 301 with the short end cap:

Image

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PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2013 5:47 pm 
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Location: Sunny Cornwall
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And there you have it....

A stock part. Nice one Stefan.


And still available too by the looks of it.

http://www.engweld.co.uk/Advice/9/Inter ... rches.html

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